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Okay guys you may think this is a stupid subvject but id like to talk about it. i mean my parents and mostly everyone doesnt beleive in it really. i wanna know your opinion!

Nope I do not believe in the Rapture. Makes for good movies though.

But I was in a bar in DC all afternoon drinking tonic water - it dulls the imagination.

This is the only Rapture I believe in.

[sorry, extra post, went back to edit which somehow became a the new note below]

No. I don't believe in the Rapture. Why do you?

Word of advice for future notes; you're more likely to get response on 9r if you put some effort into your notes (capitalizing, using proper grammar, etc.).

Lol. Maybe your right. I'll try it for now on. And yes. halfaways anyway. No one I know really beleives in it!

cooper's right though. It makes a great movie!

I don't believe in it, but I know exactly what I'll do when it happens.

>:)

Must be a Christian thing, this rapture you're talking about. Honestly I don't know what it is.... is that like an armageddon scenario when the world goes to shit and Jesus comes back to save only Jehovah's Witnesses? I thought only like 10,000 were supposed to be saved or something like that?

(Honestly, I'm not Christian and I don't know squat about the rapture, I'm not just being facetious here.)

Hey, any beleif is fine with me, i just wanna know your opinion. Also, malitic, what will you do IF the Rapture happens?

@Mike: Yes, pretty much. The belief is that 7 years before the battle of Armageddon all the Christians will be caught in the clouds (meeting Jesus along the way) in the twinkling of an eye after hearing the turmpet blast of one of God's angel and be whisked away to heaven for the duration of the Great Tribulation which will occur during the rule of the Antichrist. These are those who will not only escape the Tribulation, but also never feel the sting of death. The kick here is that they won't be the first to be whisked up, it'll be those which have already died, who will be taken fron the graves (or their ashes reconstituted, I guess), followed by those still living.

@DMAN: The short answer is that I don't. I did once, very, very fervently. But over time my beliefs have moved away from fundamentalist Christian thought into something closer to agnosticism (by most American Protestant standards). Also, I learned that the belief of the Book of Revelation (and another book which mentions it briefly near the end -- 2 Corinthians? not really sure anymore) were actually non-standard beliefs until a few huindred years after the actual book was written by John the Seer. The belief actually spawned from a small nomadic tribe, and at the moment it escapes me what the name of the founder of that particular belief is. However, the actual meaning was thought to be to give encouragement to the Church during the reighn on Nero, who was pretty much repainting his house with the blood of Christians. (If you look at the books with a strong historical context -- ie, grab a history book and really study what was going on during 50BC to, say 200AD -- you'll find that all the books make a LOT more sense and are then MUCH more directly applicable for modern life.)

Anyway, the short answer is "No" although the proliferation of technologies which match the prophecies (such as subdermal microchips) is something I watch very closely, not the least of reasons being because of their correlation to the book.

/Still need my morning coffee. Ignore any griveous grammatical mistakes.

No, I don't believe in the rapture. But, that's to be expected: I'm Buddhist, not Christian. I don't believe in heaven / hell, so I don't need to worry about going to the latter.

Yep. It's official. Hardly anyone I know beleives in the Rapture. Dang I'm one of the only ones. Its a conspiracy, man!

Also, malitic, what will you do IF the Rapture happens?

Set up my own fiefdom or give the anti-christ a run for his money.

ROFL! hahahahahahhahha

I'm not Christian, and the rapture means nothing to me.

Oh.

I though this topic was about the band The Rapture. Wikipedia enlightened me on the topic though ;) I am not Christian and no I don't believe in the Rapture.

Yeah that is a popular response silvertje. LOL. >.>

No, I don't believe in the "Rapture", although I do believe in the Second Coming (this being when Christ restores everything and everyone to himself).

Slightly related: Have any of you see the documentary The Doomsday Code? It's on both Google Video and Youtube if you want to check it out (it aired on Channel 4 in the UK sometime last year; I found it on another blog that no longer exists).

Dman,

One reason nobody really believes in the rapture is that it didn't exist as a theological concept until about 100 years ago (cf. wiki)

That's right, some preachers and evangelists (not even real theologians) made it up, and got other people to buy into it. "The rapture" is not something that existed in the history of Christianity: if you asked Paul or Thomas Aquinas or Martin Luther or any of those guys about "the rapture," they'd ask you what the hell you were talking about.

I mean, if you're going to believe in fictional entities like gods and angels anyway, the rapture is only a small further irrational leap away. But I would think one would want to hold beliefs that at least have some history behind them.

Jonah,
You are partially correct. The term "rapture" is not found any where in the Bible. It is a term used to refer to an event described in the book of Revelation. If you believe it or not is up to you, I personally believe in it.

I'm not Christian, so no.

If it works for you and offers you peace of mind and serenity, I think that's fantastic.

My favorite class I ever took in college was called End of World Studies. It was a Christian Studies class, we had a priest as our professor, and we discussed the Book of Revelations in all its historical context. It was a fantastic class.

I ended up writing my final paper on Dispensationalism and The Rapture, and read up a lot on this topic. From an academic standpoint, this is an interesting subject, but there is no way I believe in the Rapture. Just doesn't sit right with me.

Just doesn't sit right with me.

Somehow, I don't think "Rapture" "sits" -- rightly or wrongly -- with anything. Just a guess, though.

@shadeofgray:

Nope, the supposed event is not described as such in Revelation. The modern day inventors of the notion of a "rapture" certainly try to justify their creativity by referencing some texts, but that's not the same thing.

I'm really just defending the rather conservative notion that if a concept as important and impactful as the Rapture didn't occur to church fathers, priests, bishops, theologians, lay people, detractors, or anybody else for almost 2000 years, and then some English parson comes along and announces it, such an announcement should probably be received with some serious scrutiny.

@Gnorb:

Exactly right. If you believe in angels and devils, why not believe in Raptures and pink elephants, to boot? As they say in formal logic, "anything follows from an absurdity."

Jonah... have you read the Bible? Or did you just read this in wikipedia?

Although I had a somewhat christian upbringing in England, went to sunday school, learned the lords prayer etc. I had never come across the concept of the rapture until I came to the US. Anyway, I don't believe in it at all.

You don't beleive!?!? You dare defy the Book of Revalations?

I think it's pretty morbid. Even if I were Christian, I don't think I'd believe in it. Besides that, I don't think Hinduism really has a hell. We just have reincarnations.

You don't beleive in the Rapture, but you beleive in reincarnation? Okay. LOL.

You don't beleive in the Rapture, but you beleive in reincarnation? Okay. LOL.

Hmm... let's think about this:

• One scenario has millions of people (and millions more in their graves) flying up into the sky, given new bodies, and then floating up into heaven to gloat as God, in his loving retribution, delivers the Earth and the remaining inhabitants to the hands of the Antichrist in order to torture them for 7 years before eventually sending them all to Hell to burn forever and ever.
• The other has your soul -- which, by your own set of beliefs we all posses -- take on another body once it's finished in order so that it may learn the lessons it hadn't in the previous life, then once it's learned what it has to it chooses to either come back to teach others or to stay in spirit form.

Let me put it to you this way: the second actually has some -- however speculative -- supporting observations, while the first sounds like the plot for a bad quasi-scifi religious series of books and has nothing but symbolic interpretation to go along with it. Sounds to me like they're at best in equal footing. Sort of like exogenesis (and panspermia) and creationism.

By the way, you may wish to get acquainted with the idea of reincarnation in the Bible. It's as evidently there as prophecies of impending gloom and doom. (Remember, the prophesies there may have been misinterpreted.)

If you wish to discuss this further, go for it -- I'm more than happy to get into a conversation about the minutia of Christian eschatology -- but before you even THINK about deriding someone else's beliefs with such insulting and dismissive statements as the one above, then I suggest you discontinue the silly notions you hold as your own. You know, the silly beliefs about some guy (whose grave has been found) who was born of a virgin (just like Mithra) being nailed to a stick by the Romans (who, although they kept records so good we're still studying them, do not at all have a record of his death) just so he could come back to smite everyone he couldn't get to the first time around.

/Treat others and you would have others treat you.
//FYI: No, I'm not insulting Christianity. I'm merely taking a similar tone with your beliefs as you did with Hindu beliefs.

Thanks Gnorb :)

DMAN: Well, honestly, as a non-Christian, the idea of the Rapture isn't very fair, is it? So many other faiths existed before Christianity, including Judaism, Zoroastrianism, Hinduism, etc. The Rapture would make each any every one of them, the foundation of so many other religions and cultures, absolutely invalid. What other religious concept can exude such arrogance?

I was joking Gnorb! Jeez.

I believe Christ will come in "flaming fire, taking vengence on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ" and because he will only return once, there will be no Pre Tribulation rapture of the saints.

I'm a Jew and I think the whole concept of 'rapture' is for and about Christianity only. No, I can't say I've learned about what it is or that it would apply in my life at all.

I am a Christian and I actually do believe in this event called the rapture but I think its almost pointless to discuss it amongst people with little-zero Bible knowledge. As far a doctrine, its one of the last things a newbie Christian needs to iron out.

FINALLY! the surfer your the first one ive seen who beleives in it. . . . practically. Also your assumption of me being a newbie christian is really shallow, man.

i don't understand, this is a modern international community, people must understand that this God isn't a person with a long beard on a cloud, if you must seek God, find him in yourself! and then you can call it whatever you want, no he will not flood the earth or do this Rapture-thing no there is no heaven or hell and no i do not know if what i am saying is correct.
cor, sometimes i just can not believe what i am reading on the net...

Dman: I believe in the rapture, along with hundreds of thousands of other Christians; and am quite surprised at the number of people who post that they don't think it will happen. It will be an interesting (though the word "interesting" seems too weak a term to use) when, in the blink of an eye, all the Saints are gone and those left behind begin to realize that what they knew to be truth was far from it. I get so excited when I talk about this topic. This to me, along the end of times, is so interesting.

I noticed that someone referred to the passage that mentions the dead will rise before those who are Christians and alive are taken during the rapture. This passage (after studying it) does not seem to indicate we will see bodies rising from the earth. Like God, being that we were made in His image, we are made up of three parts (the body, soul and spirit. IE: for those who don't know anything about Christianity, His trinity is God, The Son (Jesus Christ) and The Holy Spirit). The body is made from dust and is returned to dust after we die, so it will not be exalted to Heaven, from everything I have found. The soul, which unlike the Spirit that is pure and blameless, has been exposed to sin and is not ready yet to stand in God's presence (and I am not saying that EVERYONE'S soul is not worthy of entering Heaven, but I believe that most are not). I have found that when the Bible speaks about the Rapture (and whomever it was that said the Bible does not use the word 'rapture' was right. Those who say that the word is not in their Bible are correct, because they are not using the Latin translation) and says that "..those who are dead in Christ shall rise first.." 1 Thes. 4:13-18, it actually refers to our souls. Not the decaying corpse that is laid to rest when we pass away or burned to ashes that can be scatted like dust in the wind. Have you ever heard it mentioned that your soul sleeps when you die? I believe that it will ascend to Heaven in the Rapture and that is actually what the reference is to when Paul speaks about the "great snatch". (I am sure there are a million jokes that could go along with that!!!...see, even Christians have a sense of humor. In fact, God has to have a sense of humor...I have met some of the morons He created!)

Here is a great site that you can visit that you might find interesting.
http://www.khouse.org/articles/2002/444/

I have so much more that I would like to say, but will save it and you can let me know if you are interested.

No matter what everyone's opinion is on the end of times, it will all come to pass just as God has planned. The neatest thing for those who believe is that nothing takes God off guard or changes the course of what He has planned for all of mankind!!!!!

But, to provide a short answer to your question, "YES, I believe, whole-heartedly, in the Rapture and look forward to the day it happens!!!!!" I also think that all those who watched and waited for the Rapture and never saw it in their lifetime still are so blessed. What's the worst that happens if you live a life that is served following God and the Rapture doesn't occur while you are on Earth? ---you still go to Heaven to spend eternity worshipping Christ! Seems like a GREAT deal to me. :)

Thanks for asking this question. It seems like you have a lot of people talking (and thinking); and that can sometimes be just what it takes to bring someone to Christ.

@ ShadeOfGray

I would say Jonah got his knowledge from the Bible...most likely. However, as for anyone who believes in the pretribulational rapture of the saints...they do not get it from the Bible.

As Jonah pointed out, there's no mention of the 'rapture' before around 1830 AD. No New Testament Christian, early church father, or 15-18th century Protestant Reformer makes any mention of it. It's a figment of some persons theological imagination.

I used to be Christian for most part of my life and I think I still am, but in a different way. Though, I've never heard of this rapture.

DMAN: Noticed you edited the note.

That said, I find this interesting:

Did you know that Newton said that the Rapture will happen in like 40 years from now? We will just have to wait and see.

Newton never ceases to amaze me. If you look at a lot of the mathematical evidence in the Bible, this seems to be a very interesting time period. The Bible speaks of the events of the Apocalypse happening before the last of the generation which sees Israel reconstituted dies. This makes 2060 about 120 years after the generation which saw Israel reconstituted (1948). Given medical advances and human physiology, that seems like a very interesting number indeed, since we can be certain (short of catastrophe) that there will be people living to that age at that time (as some are today). Also, doesn't Genesis allude to human life shortening (to about 120 years instead of 900+) after the flood?

While I'm not a believer in the Rapture, I am particularly interested in the numerological significance of many of the prediction. Very qabbalesque, if you will.

@Gnorb

There's one thing you can be sure about; whatever date any man sets as being the date of the Lord's return, you can be sure it won't be that date.

@armen: in that case, I predict every day for the next 1500 years. That ought to take care of it. (Sorry guys, but I'm not too keen on the world ending any time soon.)

I am a Christian who believes in the Bible. The problem with things like the book of Revelations is that people set on disproving its validity will look at it and only it and say, how could it possibly happen. This happens a lot with the Bible, people latch onto the New Testament and try to do the same thing all the time, while the Old Testament is ignored.

The fact is that there are so many references to events in the NT that were written about hundreds of years before Christ that it defies logic.

To answer the original question, I do believe in the events detailed in the book of Revelations. The rapture as it is called is the first event. Think of it this way, Christians who truly believe in Christ and have dedicated their hearts and minds to serving him, and this is an important point, all too many people give lip services to God, claiming to be a follower and sinning in thought and action without regret, will simply be taken to heaven.

Nothing fancy, no flying through the air, they will just disappear. Can you imagine the chaos if millions of people just disappeared out of cars, planes, etc?

Everything described in Revelations, God's plan which Satan is an unwilling part of, is there for one express purpose -- to bring unbelievers to him. That is the purpose, not to punish. In the end many will simply refuse, and will pay the ultimate price for their decision. But by that point there will be no question that the decision has been theirs to make.

I should add that this is my belief, yours and others will no doubt differ. Faith is after all a personal matter.

@Cappuccino

You are a breath of fresh air!!! I so enjoyed reading your post. I was going to add in mine how I just recently was talking to my husband, Mom and some friends about how I wonder if major airlines are lining up their pilots and co-pilots with the Rapture in mind. Even those who don't believe in Christ aren't willing to take financial risks. Could you imagine the countless lawsuits that would follow numerous passengers and pilots being taken up in the Rapture, leaving no one to pilot the aircraft, communicate from control towers, etc. My husband said, half-joking, "Sure, honey, they all line up one pilot who is Christian and one who is Muslim that way only one is taken in the Rapture." Seemed like a good enough plan to me until after a second's thought I said, as did he, the Muslim would take the plane down anyway. Okay, let the backlash begin. I make no apologies when speaking out against false gods.

I agree with you when you say that people pick apart the Bible in an attempt to disprove it. I have never felt as though I need everything that God spoke explained to me to the inth degree. I know with every fiber of my being that nothing is in the Bible by chance and everything is there to serve a purpose, but I surely don't feel it's my place to pick it apart until it no longer resembles God's word. Either you believe or you don't. Period.

Something else you said that was an "ahh-hahh" moment for me was about not floating through air. I used to take the ten minutes that I would be in the stand up tanning booth for my quiet time with God during the course of a chaotic and noisy work schedule and would think, "oh, if I go now I am glad that it's all in the blink of an eye. Could you imagine seeing someone float out of the tanning booth, completely naked..now that'd be a sight." The cool thing about not having to know all the answers is that I can chuckle at the "what if's" that are purely hypothetical and I don't have to invest time that is better spent worshipping God in all I do by dissecting His teachings. The other thing, and there were so many, that I was going to write and didn't because it was so lengthy that I did not want to lose the reader in the size of the post, is that ALL works are done in God's plan, even Satan's (and his followers’). There is nothing that is not orchestrated by God and when He says He knows "..the beginning to the end..." He's not kidding. He wrote the chapters of our lives and, though we still are given free will and can make our own decisions, nothing is done outside of God's plan. When Satan appeared in the Garden of Eden and thought that he was ruining all God had in mind, he was even working to the will of God.

What most awes me about the wondrous God we serve is that with all He created, all He is capable of and the fact that He does NOT need us like we do Him… is that all He desires from us is that we serve Him with our whole hearts and lives. That amazes me. It’s such a small gift to ask in return for the abundance he pours upon us.

One other quick thing, and then I will wrap this up, is I have often thought how many times those who are suicide bombers have completed their ‘mission’ and crossed over to the pits of hell only to wish that they could return to tell other (like-minded) followers, “Don’t do it!!! It’s a lie that we are buying into and complete deception! Please, spare your soul, your eternity, your life.”

I am so thankful that I worship the One who created me and knows the beginning of time to the moment my life on Earth will draw to a close, and all moments thereafter. Sure beats walking around, aimlessly, lost and searching for a pseudo-truth, only to find at the end of my days here that nothing was as substantial as the gospel I mocked.

@Liz You make all Christians look bad when you imply the every Muslim is a terrorist and wants to crash airplanes. We are supposed to love, God is love after all. You help no one and can only turn people away with comments like that.

@sole;

I'm not going to get into a debate about Muslims, Islam and the Quran, but if you ever find the time it's interesting, and rather frightening, to look further into their beliefs. Not the media-portrayed side of their religion or even what Muslims preach to people outside their faith when describing what a "peaceful people" they are, but the truth about the religion. It may make you re-think some of your opinions about devout Muslims.

I did not say that all Muslims are terrorist. I didn't put ALL muslims in the cockpit of the plane when I was speaking to my husband about this, the seat isn't large enough. :) But, they are 'called' to convert people to Allah at any cost, including death.

I will close with this, "There would not be a death threat out for someone who translated the Quran unless there was something brought to light that Muslims didn't want the rest of the world to know about."